I am conflicted. Yesterday I took my son to the doctor for his annual physical.
Now, let me give you some background. I’m a fairly mainstream kinda parent — or, at least I was until the medical community failed me and I started looking to natural, holistic solutions to my ailments and discovered a whole new way of looking at health and wellness and immunity.
Before that, I always took my doctor’s recommendations at face value. I vaccinated all three kids on schedule, and we go to our yearly “well check-ups” like dutiful American citizens.
A few years ago, I was of the opinion that people who opted out of vaccines were fringe crunchy granola types who at the heart of it were selfish; they choose to opt out and shelter their kids from the possible side effects, while still taking advantage of the benefits the rest of us provide as we subject our kids to the risks of vaccinations for the good of society, keeping these diseases at bay. Harsh? Yes, but that is the way the majority of Americans think.
Since delving into the world of whole foods and natural healthcare, I have come to realize that there are two ways of looking at health management — and both have their valid points.
There is the typical American way – eat whatever crap we want, stress ourselves out with too many commitments, don’t get nearly enough rest, subject ourselves to all sorts of crazy chemicals and environmental toxins, and when we get sick, we take medicine to cover up the symptoms. Then when we don’t feel better, we go for the antibiotics. Oh and add to that? We vaccinate against anything that moves.
Yes, I’m intentionally being flippant in that assessment, but it more or less sums it up.
Then there is the “natural”approach. Yes, I know, arsenic is natural. You know what we mean by “natural”.
The “natural” theory is that you can build up your immune system to fight the onslaught of germs we will come in contact with in any given day by eating a diet high in nutrient-dense, nourishing foods, getting plenty of rest, and staying active. When the natural types do get sick, they don’t run to the medicine cabinet or to the doctor’s office. Rather, they increase their intake of those nutrient dense foods, avoid sugar which is proven to weaken the immune system, and take natural foods and supplements that are proven to fight infection and disease.
They also avoid antibiotics like the plague, believing that antibiotics actually weaken the immune system by killing off the good bacterias and building up a resistance to the harmful bacterias, and when they are forced to resort to them, they start beefing up their probiotics and other methods to combat the side effects of antibiotics.
And vaccines? Forgetaboutit. It’s all a big conspiracy theory, dontchaknow. Do you have any idea the kind of money the pharmaceutical companies are making off of these things??
Okay, seriously now, the anti-vax theory goes something like this. Now, even if you have both feet firmly planted in the pro-vax camp, just take a second to consider the opposing point of view. I dare you.
Setting the whole autism/MMR debate aside, some believe that vaccines may actually challenge our immune systems and lower our ability to fight diseases. Sure, the incidence of childhood diseases has decreased since vaccines have become the norm, but hygiene and medical care is more advanced. And also, a lot of other scary diseases are on the rise… like cancer. Could there be a correlation between all the chemicals we’re injecting into our children’s bodies and the rise of cancers and the like? While lots of vaccine studies are performed, no studies have been done to test the effects of multiple vaccines in a young child’s body.
And also? I’m sure you know who funds most of the vaccine safety studies — those pharmaceutial companies — the very ones that stand to benefit largely from vaccines being not only produced but required by the medical establisment and school systems. Forgive me for not blindly trusting these guys to give us unbiased results.
Phew! Got all that?
Where do I stand on the issue? Pretty much right in the middle. Let’s just say I’m conflicted.
Last week my 5-year-old was due for the last 2 vaccines that are required for kindergarten (or at least, they are required unless you are willing to go through the rigmarole to opt out.) She had to have MMR and chicken pox. I have my doubts about the wisdom of the chicken pox vaccine, as we are now learning that there is a rise in the related disease, Shingles, at younger ages. But since she’d already had her first one, I went ahead with it.
Of course the infamous MMR was the biggie. But again, it was her second round, she had had no side effects the first time, so I felt like I probably might as well go ahead with it too.
I made the mistake of mentioning to my pediatrician that I was nervous about giving her the vaccine. Now, I love this man, and I’ve been going to him for 6 years. I find him to be very laid back and conservative and easy going. But at the very mention of my insecurity over the MMR vaccine, he. went. OFF.
I clearly hit a nerve!
Immediately he reduced me to this silly woman who had been hanging out on the internet too much (ha! little does he know!) who let the crazy autism/MMR people get to her.
I have never felt quite so small.
Of course, I didn’t go about the conversation correctly. I shouldn’t have said anything, because I went in knowing I was just going to get the shots. I didn’t go in armed with information and intelligent questions. I was just making a comment, and it blew up into a very awkward moment.
But even so. I would have just shrugged it off and moved on. But guess who was due for shots at his next checkup?
Yep. My son.
He is turning 12 this fall and was due for the the tetanus and meningococcal vaccines.
Once again, I found myself debating the issue and doing a few lame internet searches, trying to find some good information on both sides of the issue, particularly as it relates to the meningococcal vaccine.
The anti-vax stance makes sense to me in theory, and I don’t like the idea of the government regulating what I put in my child’s body. I think that rankles me more than just about anything else, frankly.
But I’m not one to buck the establishment, and my kids have never suffered any obvious ill effects from following the recommended vaccine schedule. And let’s face it, I don’t exactly relish the idea of nursing my kids through whooping cough or polio, even if they have healthy immune systems to fight them.
On the one hand, I feel like I’ve done them all to this point, why stop now. But on the other hand, they keep adding new vaccines! When do we stop?
Before you go off on how serious meningitis can be, allow me to tell you that my husband contracted meningitis as a baby, he was near death’s door, survived, but has full hearing loss in one ear as a result. It’s not a horrible disability, but it definitely affects him more than you’d think. And what his mother went through when he was in the hospital fighting for his life … I don’t want to imagine.
BUT.
I just don’t know. Do the benefits outweigh the risks?
Meningitis tends to flare up again in college students. Dr. Mercola explains that because college students tend to experience a decrease in healthy eating, their immune systems become compromised, and they are more susceptible to diseases, meningitis in particular.
Is there a better way?
Maybe.
Will we be able to keep our kids’ immune systems strong and healthy?
Who knows. College kids have minds of their own, and they think they’re invincible. I know I did.
So. Where does this leave us?
I am not convinced that vaccines are as safe as we are made to believe. But I’m having an awfully hard time finding good information presented in an objective manner. And as I said, bucking the establishment has never been my strong suit.
And what if . . .
WHAT IF?
What would I do if I declined a vaccine and my son caught meningitis as a teen and was brain damaged or worse?
And yet again… how can we be confident that the onslaught of chemicals via vaccinations are not depleting our immune systems and leaving us more susceptible to (or perhaps even contributing to) the cancers and other diseases of this modern age?
Ugh. Just, UGH.
Yesterday morning I took my son to the doctor, and we got the vaccinations as prescribed.
I cannot say that I’m at peace with this decision. But I can’t say that I regret it either.
I just don’t know.
Please don’t write in and tell me how bad things were before vaccines. I know. I get that. I DO.
But I also get that there is a buttload of money to be made on these things, and they are not without their own set of risks.
I wish there was a good place to go for unbiased information. Until then, I continue to tow the line, follow the schedule, second guessing myself every step of the way.
67 Responses
I appreciate that you put yourself out there with this post as this is such a controversial topic. The bottom line for me is that parents need to not be scared into making a decision about their children’s health. As someone who had a similar experience with the medical community at a very young age (17) I started my parenting life as someone who researched the heck out of every decision involving my health and my family’s health.
The results I came up with may not be the same as someone who has read and researched the same things I did, and I’m ok with that.
I think the best thing to do is talk about vaccinating as you do here-it’s such a big topic and so full of misunderstandings, miscommunication and hard stances on both sides. It kinda reminds me of politics. 😉
Personally I think you should take your time to talk to your doctor, read, research and make a decision, and there is no reason why you can’t delay vaccinations for a month or two while you make a decision.
You’re so brave for writing about this-I hope the comments remain a place of friendly debate because it takes a LOT to put this info out there.
Difficult decisions, for sure. I think, if my children were young again, I would likely immunize, but I would spread them w-a-y out. No piggy-backing…And I would research and do only those that I felt were absolutely necessary. I think, regardless of what the typical medical doctors say, there is overwhelming evidence against vaccinations. That being said, I would be middle of the road, do a huge amt. of research, and be extremely cautious. Extremely cautious….
I do think, if I could start over again, I would space them out more. And maybe be more selective, maybe. I dunno. LOL.
One thing I do not to at all anymore is the flu shot. And the way it is advertised so heavily at every grocery store and pharmacy really turns me off, just sayin’.
I went through these same internal discussions after I had my son. Eventually I decided to get all the vaccines, but I spaced them out so that he only got one at a time. It just seemed like such a load on his little system to get so many shots at once. I talked to my doctor about it (thankfully he didn’t blow up the way yours did), and he believes the vaccines are safe and necessary, but he said I could do whatever I chose. I never got any hassle from him about spreading them out and they worked with me really well on planning which ones he should get when.
I am middle of the road too. I never gave it a thought back in the day when mine were vaccinated but the young mom now have so much knowledge now at their fingertips…..AND, they do NOT TRUST their doctor like we did. Our mindset was *whatever the doctor says* is best. That was before money and politics ruled most everything. Sad, but true. So glad my children have the resources available to help them make decisions.
Oh, and I’m with you on the flu shot. Three years in a row after taking it, I was sick. (And no, I’m not allergic to the eggs they grow it in.)
I’m right there with you. I’ve always followed the schedule and today was no different. Took my son for his 5 year well check and was due for his second MMR and chicken pox. Like you, I went along since he had the first and had no side effects. I, on the other hand, did get him the flu shot. I always have. Still debating about that one.
Thank you for sharing this post. I struggle with making those decisions of vaccinating. I am a young mother who is just starting out down this road and I feel like so many of the new vaccines are unneccessary. My daughter just got the hepatitis A vaccine-I didn’t even realize this was a vaccine they now give and if I could have researched it more, I probably would have declined it. I wasn’t comfortable with the chicken pox vaccine either. I have declined the flu shot for her and myself and I get a lot of flak for it. I don’t know if I could stand up to the doctors and let them know how I feel about the ones they say are mandatory. I am currently pregnant with my second and struggle with what I will do about the vaccines. I hate going through this. I’d like to try a delayed schedule this time but I’m not sure how the doctors at this office feel about it. I would love to know of a ped or a family doctor in our area who is okay with spacing vaccines out.
Kristin, I urge you to ask around. I really wish I’d at least spaced them out some. And I just recently found out about a practice near me that is open to that. I wish I’d just asked sooner, ya know?
When Austin was 12 we got him the vaccination too (mostly the doctor just administered them as part of a physical, as if there were no choice). But I am too nervous about such things to completely by-pass them.
I love watching your mental innerworkings. Thank you so much for giving a balanced view, including all the mental anguish we go through as Moms to reach our decisions only to be undermined by medical professionals.
My latest rant is about the HPV vaccine, as I have a 14 yoa daughter and the huge amount of advertising and physician push for it just downright pisses me off. But then I start down the what if path and how will I live with myself if she contracts it and I could have prevented it?
Apparently parenting decisions will consume us until the end of time. 🙂
I’ll be facing that one in a few more years. It isn’t required yet, is it? I am pretty confident I will decline it, or opt out if it is required by then. That one galls me. I may have to switch practices, and fortunately, I just learned of one that would be sympathetic to any opting out. I wonder if they would be more objective to talk to about the issues. Hmmm…
What practice would be ok with spacing out or skipping some vaccines? I’m not thrilled with our current pediatrician and could be open to switching…
Our governor has tried to require the HPV vaccine in TX (Rick Perry). In fact, it may be required. We will opt out. I am usually not one to skip vaccines, but this one is to prevent diseases that are primarily related to sex*ual activity. I am not so naive as to think I will always know what my kids are doing, but I will be proactive on this one. And it is such a new vaccine that it is impossible to know what kind of effects it might have. Will my daughter be infertile because of this vaccine? Will she have other female problems? Who knows! I won’t let her be the guinea pig.
I appreciate your balanced approach to this topic.
For me, it was important to find a doctor who was knowledgeable and cares about my child, which I do believe most pediatricians love children. I appreciate his recommendations for natural remedies and only prescribe antibiotics when necessary (which has been never for my two kids). He does fully support the vax schedule, and I trust him. His office actually loses money with our health insurance when my kids get immunizations, but he’s one of those doctors that takes everyone…health insurance or not…he even rode his bike over to my friend’s homebirth after she had delivered just to check on her baby. I know people like this are hard to find, but it certainly puts my mind at ease when making decisions about my childrens’ health.
Great post and I’m going to reserve my opinion because I think you know where I stand considering my where my paycheck comes from. Really though, you have to stop thinking of the big pharma’s as money hungry mongers. I can speak for where I work, we work hard to improve the health of people and hopefully find treatments and cures for diseases, like cancer. I work with a lot of dedicated scientists that devote their lives to their research and helping find cures.
On the flip side, as with everything, its a business and it costs money to do the research as well as people, people who have to be paid. So yes, its going to be expensive. I think I’ve said enough already.
You know that I absolutely believe that most people working for big pharma (or big ag or any other big abbreviation, lol) are not out to get rich at the expense of the welfare of the general population. And living where we live, I know that our local economy and the livelihood of many of my good friends are highly dependent on the pharmaceutical companies thriving, so I want to tred carefully.
But as I’ve read about some of the stuff that goes on behind the scenes, and how law makers and scientists have known the dangers of certain foods and drugs and still pushed them thru for approval, I have lost a lot of respect and trust in the institution as a whole, and it makes wary of everything now. (And I am speaking specifically of certain drugs and foods, not vaccines in particular.)
It’s a sticky wicket – how to guard the public health without imposing undue regulations on individuals. It’s not that vaccines are created, but that they are mandated, that makes me question the system.
(And I also want to add that I realize that my doctor is giving the same vaccines to his kids that he is advising me to give to mine. I believe without a shadow of a doubt that he believes he is giving me the safest advice. And for all I know, maybe he is. I just didn’t appreciate the way he spoke to me.)
I agree with regarding the Doc – no doctor should speak to a patient or parent that way. It should be a partnership in caring for our kids.
My advice would be to pray about it. Then do what you feel most comfortable doing. Tetanus shots are very useful, but are usually only needed when you step on a rusty nail (or something metal cuts through the skin) and can be given and be effective after the fact, so it isn’t like you are risking your life if you haven’t had one in the last 10 years. It is one that can go either way, but may be necessary if he is playing sports? As for the meningococcal, I had meningitis when I was a baby. The doctors said I would die. Then they said I would have brain damage. Then they said I wouldn’t walk. I am fine. No side effects whatsoever from having it. My best friend from high school also had it when she was very young. She had no lasting effects from it either. We had different types of meningitis (because, yes, there is more than one type of it but the shot doesn’t have all the strains). I strongly feel that God will guide you if you ask. We take risks just walking out the front door every day and we shouldn’t live in fear of the what ifs. Pray, make a decision, and know that whatever happens God knows the plan and will help you through it!
My problem is with doctors for the most part. The majority of them don’t even want to discuss vaccines with parents. We have vaccinated, although on a slightly slower plan. Our first pediatrician was much more willing to work with us than our current one. Thankfully we see the nurse practitioner, who is much more willing to let us space them out a bit. The one resource that I found was the best for a neither pro nor anti vaccine approach was The Vaccine Book by Dr. Sears (https://www.amazon.com/Vaccine-Book-Decision-Parenting-Library/dp/0316017507). He goes through and outlines the risk for each disease and lists the ingredients in the vaccine. He does have a proposed alternate vaccine schedule in the back, which I tried to use, but with our first doctor we had to change it a bit more to make her comfortable. Often the problem with spacing is that some of the individual shots are just not available at your doctor’s office.
I wish that doctors would take the time to actually make a vaccine schedule for each child that fits that child and families needs and desires. But then they wouldn’t get paid for all that time spent with you.
P.S. I’m the daughter of a doctor, and also the sister of a pediatrician, and my husband works for a pharmaceutical company 🙂
I do not have kids so thankfully I have never had to make this decision for them, but I do own cats. I also have health issues that are not being helped by conventional “western medicine’ and I’m “going granola” and in the process vaccines are discussed a lot. Here is a great resource for that https://kellythekitchenkop.com/?s=vaccines
But in vaccinating my cats I have followed along with what ever the vet suggeted for years. Low and behold I was overly vaccinating my cats by three fold in many cases (vaccines that should be given every three years were given yearly) and shortly after the truth came to light for me one of my cats developed vaccine associated sarcoma. It is all too common (considering it is called a rare disease) in cats and small dogs. Some question if we aren’t giving too much vaccine in one go (and too often) becuase small dogs and large dogs get the same dose and large dogs almost never get VAS.
With all the controversy and the “internet crazy” dismissals over human vaccines, discussions of the risks of animal vaccines are often dismissed. The specialist I brought my cat to made it a point to tell me to make sure to continue to vaccinate. Since I foster kittens for a local animal shelter and I see what these diseases can do first hand, I am pro vaccine, but I’m also pro information. Read, learn, know your risk, and when a vet (or a doctor) gets defensive, it is a sign that something is wrong. They should be willing to have the discussion with you. Being pro vaccine is fine, but when they get defensive I get concerned.
I’ve had the discussion with my own vet several times since learning of Ollie’s cancer. My cats are all currently due for vaccines, and I’m 99% sure I’m not going to do them. That might change in the future because of the risk my cats deal with because of my fostering, but for now, I think the risk of giving the vaccine is a bit more then not. (I keep my fosters isolated and any deadly disease that I might vaccinate against is a cat to cat contact) and yes, I totally agree that a well nourished body (cat or human) has a much stronger resistance to disease. I see it ALL THE TIME in my fostering and with in my own crew.
Ugh is right. When I was making the vaccination decision 13 years ago when my first was born, that’s how I felt – “damned if you do/don’t” kinda thing. I had two friends who didn’t know each other and lived on different coasts who were absolutely convinced that their formerly healthy and now autistic sons became “different” after the 18 month MMR. I trust a mother’s wisdom, even if she has no health credentials. Both of them told me similar stories – that they could look at their baby’s photos before and after the MMR and see a difference. (I’m not saying the MMR *causes* autism. I believe that in susceptible individuals that it may give it a push. Correlation, in other words.)
Fast forward to today, and I grow a little more confident in my decision each year. I have 5 unvaccinated kids and when I met my husband, was surprised to find that my stepdaughter has also never been vaccinated. She attends public school, my bio kids are homeschooled. When I compare them to their peers, they’re clearly more healthy. SO many of their friends have some chronic illness, whether it be asthma, diabetes, allergies, or just chronic colds and coughs that last for weeks (months) at a time. My kids get VERY sick for a day, maybe two. And that’s it. I call it a strong immune response. They all get good high fevers and then get well *quickly*.
Incidentally I found a pediatrician who sees my kids every couple of years, and he didn’t vaccinate his own kids. The same is true for every chiropractor I’ve ever known.
I’m sorry, I forgot to say something!
I think the bottom line for me is: What can you live with?
In other words, if you were to vaccinate and your kid had a reaction, could you live with that? Or if you didn’t vaccinate and your kid did become sick and have ongoing health issues as a result, could you live with that?
I chose the latter. From my research, the severity of the childhood illnesses depends on the host. So I long term breastfeed (4 years+), and do everything I can to keep my kids healthy. Except for an infected finger in a preschooler once, none of them has ever required antibiotics. They’ve never had an ear infection. They’re very healthy.
When they do get a little cold or something I hit the books and remind myself of the symptoms of various illnesses and watch them like hawks.
I respect parents no matter what decision they make in this regard – honestly.
Ughhh……..I am so with you. Before our little girl was born, we had decided NOT to vaccinate. But then I was an absolute stressed out mess for fear of her contracting some nasty disease that a vaccinated child was carrying but not getting sick b/c they WERE vaccinated. So we decided to vaccinate some (but not all) and on a WAY slower schedule than what was recommended. As in one shot at a time. Not a here, let’s give your 15 pound child 10 different nasty germs/viruses all at once schedule. In fact, she just turned three and every time she has her check up I have to explain that we are doing our own thing and not going on the recommended schedule, etc, etc. Then I get THOSE looks like you said that I am just a silly mom, blah, blah, blah. But I too question our decision all the time. It’s inner turmoil I tell you….
Just reading through the other comments…..we do have to make the best decisions we can and then trust in Him. My mom has said this over and over to me: God can take care of our loved ones way better than we can. That pretty much sums it up, because he is ultimately in control anyway. Which is hard for me, b/c I am such a control freak. (Sadly!)
And just a question for you–chicken pox is one we have decided against. You had mentioned something about Shingles and that vaccine….I am just curious, what have you come across?
Not much – it’s just one of those “I heard somewhere” sorta things. I didn’t research it b/c we’d already done the one, so I figured it was too late to go back. Sigh…
Great post. Captures what a lot of moms are going through. My son (almost 2) has gotten all the vaccines, but I spaced them out so he never gets more than one shot at an appointment. Our first ped practice was a big one with a bunch of docs and they said they were ok with this, but then at his one-year appointment a physician’s assistant completely lost it on me, saying I was playing with fire, yelling at me in front of my mom, and ignoring the fact that I kept repeating that I was getting him all the vaccines, just not all in that day (he was totally up to date at that point too).
The practice we are at now is a single doc practice and I met with him ahead of time and told him my plan (get all vaccines, but space out). He told me he is against it and follows the schedule to the dot, but as long as I would be getting all the vaccines, he would be ok with me spacing them out and has been to date, although each time I come for a vaccine appt, his nurses give me a lot of “Why is your son’s vaccine schedule so out of order? Why are you here now?”
For our next child I may look for a practice where they are a little more supportive because it is stressful to have to get that attitude for questioning the almighy vaccine schedule, especially when I am not against vaccinations. No one, however, has made a convincing argument that all the shots need to be given on one day (other than convenience/compliance). I am concerned that it is a lot for a little body to deal with so much at once especially if I don’t have a problem with hauling us to the doc once a month to keep up with all the shots.
Anyway, thanks for the post, it helps to know others out there are thinking about this too.
The thing is, right now you’re either for vaccines, all of them, or you’re against them, all of them. There does not seem to be room for a reasoned investigation of each vaccine on it’s own or how we schedule them. And there should be. Some vaccines, like small pox, were truly great things that have made a huge difference in public health. Others, like chicken pox, seem to have more of an economic value vs a public health, or at least that was how the argument was phrased to me when we were researching it. And the timing and spacing of some of the vaccines, like the Hepatitis vaccine given to all babies at birth, vs perhaps an at risk subset, seem to be more for the convenience of medical personnel with the faith that it does no harm.
We don’t vaccinate for the flu in our family and our pediatrician knows that and accepts it with a professional smile. I love her for it. It’s disappointing that your pediatrician isn’t able to allow reasonable doubt and entertain a discussion. Perhaps he’s tired of the rucus Michelle Bachman’s comments have caused. Its nice when the parent-pediatrician relationship can be a collaboration between the person who knows medicine best and the person who knows their child best.
I think vaccines are great things but I’d like them to be approached with more respect and caution by the medical community. It feels a bit like the ’80s when we were given antibiotics for every little thing.
Yes, yes yes, to all of that. YES.
And in my doctor’s defense, perhaps if I’d gone in and started out differently, and actually asked questions, he would have responded differently. I just kind of threw out an offhand “I”m kind of nervous about this shot…” and then he started in.
But even so. You’d think if a mother suggests that she is nervous about something, you’d tread (tred?) a bit lighter. Whatev. LOL.
JOLYNNE. I am in the exact same place. My kids are behind on their vaccinations. Not because I’m following a great well-researched plan to delay…it’s b/c I just don’t know what to do! I don’t want to fill them up with every who-knows-what-it-is chemical known to man! And of course, I don’t want them to have polio/et al. But, you said it, UGH.
Of course, if/when I do finally get them caught up, they are going to kill me b/c they’re going to have to get 20 at once. UGH.
With my 5 year old son, we followed the vaccine schedule like a good patient should. But, after doing some research, and really using my mom’s intuition, I started to have second thoughts by the time our daughter arrived. I asked our Ped a simple question regarding vaccines, and like the reaction you received, he went off on me, then handed me a letter letting me know that if we should choose to space out our children’s vaccines or omit any, then I would need to find another pediatrician. So, I did. I parted on good terms with him, but felt firmly I was making the best choice for our children. As parents, we are our children’s best advocates. If there is something we feel uncomfortable about, we should feel free to ask “What are you giving my child?” and feel the freedom to decline should we feel it is not in their best interest.
Our new pediatrician is allowing us to space our children’s vaccines so they are not receiving multiples at a time, and forego some we don’t feel necessary. I feel comfortable with this measure. Vaccines are a good thing and have prevented some really horrible diseases, however, I do feel that each parent needs to do what is best for their family whether that be sticking to the CDC schedule, altering the schedule, or foregoing them completely. Thanks for the boldness in writing this post…this is a HOT topic, and I don’t forsee that changing anytime soon.
Such a great post – I really appreciate the thinking and hard work that went into it. I also appreciate your journey with health, eating and medicine! As one who ends up in a lot of conversations on forums, groups and FB with other moms – vax/non-vax is SUCH a tense and controversial topic! I’m not sure where I stand. I’ve been doing the vaccinations as scheduled for both my kids with no problem as of late. But – you are right about the “What if’s?” What if we GET the vax, and we later find it causes cancer? What if we DON’T get the vax, and my kid dies of polio? It’s sticky. And I think it’s frustrating that we cannot TRUST the research – the ones funded by the companies who benefit – by the government that is set in place for our “best interests.”
I just don’t know.
But I WILL say – if there is one concrete thing I can tell you from that post – is that you should never be made to feel “small” by your doctor! Sometimes I wonder if that’s a medical defense mechanism: when doctors are faced with opposition – they default to the knowledge they have but we don’t (or, at least, the apparent knowledge). Doctors should be apart of this conversation, journeying with us.
Keep on keeping’ on, Jo-Lynne!
Wow, lots of opinions already. I am pro-vax for me and my kids. I have an awesome family doctor and allergist. I’ve talked to them about flu shots for me and I get them. Just got the pertussis booster as well. Have a great pediatrician too. I talked with them all, I trust them and I get the shots.
The one point I disagree on is that some anti-vax people think if your kid has a healthy immune system, that’s going to carry them through a terrible illness that they haven’t been vaccinated against. That’s too much of a risk for me. There is a reason they developed vaccines for these illnesses. Measles, mumps, pertussis, polio, all of them–they not only have horrible symptoms, but can result in life-long complications (like your husband’s deafness) and even death. With all the options available to me, I choose to try to spare my children those diseases.
I think it depends on the person you’re talking to. Yeah, some anti-vax people can seem flippant and overly confident that they can stay healthy enough to ward off any serious diseases, but most take the decision to opt out very seriously and realize they’re trading one set of risks for another.
Like any classification, it’s easy to stereotype, but everyone has a bit of a different take on it, no matter which side of the line they stand on.
Whew, what a touchy subject for people! But I am so glad to see that the comments thus far are civil. 🙂
We are pretty “middle of the road,” too, which honestly seems to me like the hardest “side” to be on, because whichever way you go, there’s potential “guilt” and “what-if?s” A number of our friends have chosen not to vaccinate their kids at all, and we purposefully asked them for Dr recommendations because we didn’t want a pediatrician who was going to lecture us every time we saw him about why we should give our child every single vaccine available. And I’m happy to say that our doctor is amazing; he is definitely pro-vaccine, but fully respects that it is OUR decision to make.
We have a toddler and one on the way. I read The Vaccine Book by Dr. Sears (highly recommend that, btw) and took my sweet old time deciding what to do with our son. In the end, we opted to only give him the DTAP, mainly for the pertussis component since you can’t get that by itself. He was 9 months old before he got the first shot.
My husband has been doing more reading on the subject and I think we will vaccinate the next baby, but on an alternative or “delayed” schedule, which spreads them out more so they don’t get three or four at once. That’s a lot for a tiny little body to handle!
Anyway, it’s nice to know that other people are in the middle, like we are. To be frank, most of our good friends are on the “anti” side so I felt a little guilty when I said we were going to vaccinate the next baby! Usually it’s the opposite 😉
I have been dealing with infertility for years and I’m pretty well convinced that a lot of the “new” childhood disorders are not caused by vaccines, but by fertility medications. We have been vaccinating children and adults for a LONG time but the widespread use of fertility drugs is a more recent development. Not that every mother who uses the drugs will have a child with autism, add, developmental delays, etc, but I certainly think it is a valid concern and one that deserves extensive research. I wonder if the dosages make a difference, the timing, the type of drug (ovulation inducing vs. other types, etc). It just seems like childhood disorders are continuing to rise and there are definitely A LOT of factors that could potentially contribute to that – medication, vaccines, our diet, food additives, environmental toxins, etc.
After living in a 3rd world country, I honestly feel thankful I have access to vaccinations.
Gretchen, thanks for adding this perspective. I have a good friend whose husband grew up in a third world country, and they vaccinate against EVERYTHING. I do think that we become so insulated, we don’t realize how bad it is in other places, or how bad it used to be.
that is such a great perspective to bring up. It’s easy to think in our american “bubble” – but when we think on a world wide lens – and what we COULD face (and people DO face on a daily basis because of where they live) – it puts things into perspective. We have several loved ones in Africa – and they bring that perspective to us as well…
My problem with vaccines is how they are administered, a “one-size-fits-all” mentality. We have come a long way from smearing some small pox pus on an open wound to the heavy vaccine schedule (required in the US) of today. As a result, I think we have traded childhood illness (chicken pox, measles, mumps) for lifelong illness (asthma, ADHD, allergies, etc.)
Our oldest daughter was fully vaccinated until I started reading all I could get my hands on. She never received her chicken pox or MMR booster before kindergarten, and honestly, the school didn’t bat an eye. (PA law only requires a letter for exemption from the vaccination policy.) My youngest received only limited vaccines, ones that I thought were “safe,” i.e. only one disease/illness and saline, no heavy metals or aluminum.
I would really like to see the pharma companies change their formulations… I know quite a few people who are willing to vaccinate if they could get, say, the MMR broken up into three separate shots. Why not at least offer this as an option? I would also like to see insurance companies stop paying doctors a “bonus” for a heavily vaccinated patient population.
I know several people who have children that contracted the chicken pox SEVERAL TIMES, even though they had all required doses of the chicken pox vaccine. What’s wrong with this picture?
The bottom line is that I feel blessed to have a choice. “The Vaccine Book – Making the Right Decision for Your Child” by Robert W. Sears is an excellent book that presents the debate evenly from both sides.
Great post. My kids are teens and have been given everything “on schedule”. Thankfully they’ve never had a problem. If I could go back I would have researched things and probably spread them out. We used to do yearly flu shots but have opted out of those after the big swine flu year (which they both got because we weren’t comfortable with the vaccine). I’m also opting out of the HPV for my daughter (even though her pediatrician & my family doctor think every girl should get it). I wish I had been more informed on whole foods/natural healthcare when I was in my 20’s. I lean more that way now. 🙂
Oh wow. Good for you for bringing this up. It can get very heated. As you know I am a healthcare provider and I am clearly in support of vaccines. However….I don’t like giving them all at once. When my child was little I did because I really never gave it a second thought. Now that she is older, I spaced them out. I really have no rational scientific reason for doing this, but I just don’t think our immune system was designed to whip up an awesome response to let’s say…FOUR different diseases at once. But in the end I’ve done them all…I’ve watched a teenager lose her limbs one by one to meningitis and it’s a chance I’m not willing to take. If you’ve actually SEEN it, it makes it real and you know it isn’t some conspiracy that was dreamed up by the vaccine companies.
Thanks for writing this post. It’s nice to read thinking in process. I haven’t read through all of the comments but I’ll second, third or maybe fourth the Dr Sears Vaccine Book for anyone doing research. It’s easily understood and I feel presented without emotion.
All three of our kids have been vaxed a little differently. We had a schedule for the first two based on a different book and our ped at the time was supportive of what we wanted. We started later and only did one at a time except for the IPV which I think we did together with the HiB (or something like that). We’ve since switched drs and this one delays all vax anyway so I’m just following what she recommends. She doesn’t recommend the chicken pox, she had a vaxed 8 yr old patient with shingles. Just anecdotal but interesting.
One nice thing about waiting to start is that with many you’ll need fewer shots to gain immunity.
I am having a difficult time with deciding what to do about the HPV vaccine; my daughters are 18 and 13. Ive turned it down everytime they had their physicals as the doctor (and also my gyn) would suggest them getting it. Then they would make me feel like a terrible mom when I said “not at this time”. To me, it’s not been around too long, so we don’t know what kind of effect it has on girls in 5-10 years who are getting the vaccine now. I thought about letting my girls decide when they are old enough to make that decision. I am torn as female cancers run in my mom’s family. I know what you mean about feeling guilty if then they get sick because they weren’t vaccinated.
Both daughters got their early shots, except my youngest didn’t get the chicken pox vac because our dr. at the time didn’t give it. She never got chix pox, but when she was 8, she wanted to get it because she’d seen classmates come back to school scabbed over, and she didn’t want that to happen to her.
Knock wood, my children are healthy. They rarely get sick, except for the occasional 24 hr. bug, so they don’t get many antibotics. My oldest is allergic to most of them anyway.
I know, I feel the same way! My daughter had a reaction to her first Hep B vaccination as a newborn, ending up in the NICU for 11 days and on an apnea monitor for 7 months. Now she has neurological disorders and although she’s high functioning, I always wonder. However, we did all her other vaccinations just more on our own schedule. But the schools make this almost impossible….here in Hawaii they pressured me to give her yet another Hep B because her two doses were just a few days shy of the recommended 6 month point. There was NO WAY I was going to give her a third dose after everything else this one had caused! It’s a big headache, I feel you!
I’m exactly where you are…right smack dab in the middle. And I have no advice for you, just empathy. 🙂
Same exact thing happened to me at the docs. We may even be going to the same building since we live close to each other. They squashed me down to an ant. I felt like a child. Just my opinion, of course, but I think we can do without if our children weren’t in the classroom day after day. Sitting on the floor, squished together. Learning and coughing all over each other. If they were home with us, we could better remain healthy. Twenty little people sitting together in the classroom every single day? Not a chance. I have one in K and one in 2nd, and I skipped flu shot on my older one last year and she missed three times more school than the younger who received the flu shot. So many kids, so many more things to come across. Sometimes I just jump in with two feet and say a prayer!
My son had a bad reaction to his vaccines as a baby and it scared me enough to stop doing them. At that time the MMR/Autism link was still considered an issue and that definitely contributed to my decision to hold off on additional vaccines. My son is now 4 and I feel like we should try to start getting him back on track before he gets to kindergarten, but am honestly quite scared about it, although I’m not sure it’s a rational fear. I am torn, I worry that he’ll have another bad reaction if I do vaccinate but also that he’ll get sick if I don’t.
I cannot even begin to express how muc.h you encompassed my feelings about this whole issue in this post.
My kids have mostly been vaccinated on schedule but I started spreading them out with my second. I think he is caught up but I know my 3rd child is not. She’s kinda behind but I don’t care. We’ll catch up at some point. And like your children, mine have never had any issues.
BUT
That being said, I just WISH SO HARD that we didn’t even have to worry about what those who are authorities on this kind of stuff, say, you know? I hate that we even have to question vaccines at all and not just be grateful to have them to protect our children from horrible diseases.
I just wish…
Jo-Lynn,
Recently, at my 12 yo daughter’s well check appointment, she needed to get her 7th grade vaccinations. When the doctor came in and started talking about the vaccines, she asked me if I wanted her to get the HPV (Human Papillomavirus) vaccination. I was shocked that she asked this. HPV is an STD…my daughter is 12!! I understand kids are having sex at this age, but I was not ready for that. Needless to say, she DID NOT get that vaccination.
I’ve always gotten the vaccinations that were required for my children without even thinking that they could be harmful. It isn’t until more recently, since reading your blog actually, that a lot of these issues are being brought to the forefront of my mind. Along with the food we eat and where it comes from.
Unfortunately, I’ve been one of those moms with my head in the sand for far too long. My kids are relatively healthy so I’ve never had any reason to believe that our food and or medicines are actually harming us.
You’ve opened my eyes to a lot of issues. I guess I’ve spent too many years thinking that our gov’t is looking out for our best interest. Why, I don’t know…maybe I’m too trusting or I want to believe that they do have our best intentions in mind. But history paints a different picture and I should have known better.
I have to admit that it is overwhelming when you start reading about the manufacturing processes and how our food is produced in this country, but I’m taking baby steps. I can’t do it all but I AM making an effort, little by little. Thank you for your insight.
Jo-Lynne you have the nicest readers! I took a deep breath when I clicked thru your post in my email to read the comments. Good (brave) post and truly thoughtful, respectful commenting all the way around! (ok, I didn’t read all the comments so I may have missed a bad apple ;)… )
I swear, every time a new email with this post’s subject line comes thru, I take a deep breath before opening it! LOL.
I DO have the nicest readers!!!
I’m with Julie. Whenever I have read and participated in a blog post such as this, pro-vaxers have gotten really mean. Accusing non-vaxers of killing children, and just more nasty stuff. This was a great blog post. Jo-Lynne, I love how real you are with issues like this in your life. We are non-vaxers and have been for some time. It isn’t easy being on this side of the coin. But we are secure in our informed choice for our children. (And is has nothing to do with AUTISM! 😉 ) nvic.org is a great neutral organization and I love reading the posts from Inside Vaccines on Facebook, which is definitely not neutral. To give you a pro-vax side I do also read Shot of Prevention. I understand most of their points but easily disagree. It’s good to read both sides though. 🙂
Just wanted to add my two cents worth. I guess I’m technically anti-vax FOR MY FAMILY. I (with my husband obviously) made the best choice FOR MY FAMILY. That’s my biggest hang-up. No one should ever be made to feel that they HAVE to have the vaccinations. (by the way, I appreciate them being called vaccinations not immunizations as they do here in AUS) Each family needs to do their own research and make up their mind on what is best for their own family. I don’t care if someone vaccinates or not but I hope they got to make an informed choice and weren’t bullied into it or told that they had to do it for their children to go to school. And as I respect other people’s decisions I hope they respect mine.
p.s. being an American in Australia I’ve always taken offense when people talk about “arrogant American doctors” because seriously I’m sure there are plenty arrogant Australian doctors. But with this pregnancy one of the doctors I met with was just that kind of American doctor and made me feel so small and idiotic just because I asked questions about procedures. no doctor should ever make his patients feel that way IMO.
Lots of responses here! You’ve covered it all. My kids are older, and I got most vaccines. I didn’t do one of the Hep. ones, nor have I done the infamous shot for ovarian cancer. I let my daughter decide about the menn. shot before college, and after reading some, she decided to get it.
I guess all I can say is that the correlation between immunizations/vaccinations and decrease in those horrific diseases seems very clear to me. I don’t think we can attribute it simply to better hygiene. But the correlation between Big Pharma and the vaccines offered to our kids — that cause/effect is not certain. I’m not sure that these vaccines are just a result of people’s desire for $$. So, between the two, I chose what I consider useful shots. I do believe that those diseases took so many lives, and that (at least so far) science has mitigated their effects. I hope that the next 100 years proves that we didn’t make huge mistakes.
Just to clarify, the HPV shot is to protect from cervical cancer. There is no shot, that I am aware of, to protect against ovarian cancer nor is there any test to check for ovarian cancer.
What a great blog post. Yes, this is a very controversial topic but also a very confusing one for parents. I believe you do the best research possible, talk to other parents and have good communication with your pediatrician and then you do what you think is best for *your* kids and *your* family. And then you (parents in general, not you specifically) need to respect the decisions people make on this topic.
My kids are 9 1/2 girl and almost 5 boy. With my first-born I did what was standard practice and had her receive all the vax, not realizing there was such controversy until I started meeting other moms. When my boy came along 4 1/2 years later I had done research but still felt confused. We decided to go ahead with all the vax except the MMR, we decided to delay that one. We did our research, went in to the pediatrician to discuss our decision to delay with the reasons why and asked her for her thoughts. We had a great discussion and she worked with us on delaying the one vax.
With all that being said, our daughter has health issues (juvenile rheumatoid arthritis, reflux of bladder along w/other bladder issues) and we’ve wondered if any of the vax contributed to these medical issues. We’ll never know as our son has no medical conditions . She does receive the flu vax every year b/c if she were to contract the flu her immune system can be compromised to the point that the JRA flares up and that can be worse than the flu. It’s very tough for parents to know to believe and trust when researching medical issues. At this point we feel we’ve done so much via traditional western medicine that we’ve recently been looking into eastern and alternative medicine (meeting with an acupuncturist for accupressure, meeting with a dietician to discuss foods that will help with her medical issues, etc.).
I really applaud you for publishing this post b/c as we know it can turn an informative, smart, and intelligent conversation into an ugly one. I feel that we parents need to help each other and share what we have learned so we can make educated decisions for our families. As they say, it takes a village.
Great post! So much to think about when considering our children’s well being. We are torn both ways as parents. I was also a young mum that went along with vaccinating my children, having been a nurse. However on his second vaccination my firstborn had a reaction… a brain swelling apparently to whooping cough component (pertussis). This caused a major reconsideration to submitting my innocent babies to unknown and unpredictable responses, some with the chance of permanent damage. On advice from medicos, there was no more whooping cough vaccine for either my children, but we continued with tetanus, diptheria, polio. We were advised against the MMR. I was always fearful when whooping cough was around esp as one son had bad asthma. The children also contracted chicken pox and measles and they were very ill, they are serious illnesses. It was awful to nurse them through it hoping they would have no long lasting effects from the disease itself and wondering if I could have prevented it by having those vaccines.
I agree with the principal of vaccines, as ideally it would be wonderful to have such protection. However like others, there is no magic potion that can be guaranteed to be safe for all. It’s that lack of guarantee and that small potential of long term risks … either if vaccinated or not …that is the cause of much anxiety for responsible loving parents. Fortunately I didn’t have a bad response from the doctor at the time, he could see my strong desire to do the best thing by my babies. However in a lot of parent circles, I was often reluctant to state our experience, as the pro vaccine people are often very forceful in their ‘voice’! Therefore I applaud you for raising the post, and I certainly agree that this needs to be an open and honest discussion in public forums as we all need to be fully informed and be able to trust medicos to be giving us the full information. Thanks for the Interesting reading above!
I completely understand where you are coming from! It’s good to read that other mothers feel the same way.
I was wondering, with the cold and flu season coming up if you had come across any books/sites/resources on building up immunity for fighting all the germs floating around? Thank you!
I rely on Katie at Kitchen Stewardship, Kelly the Kitchen Kop and Lydia at Divine Health, among other “real foodie” bloggers to keep me informed on that sort of thing.
I am so with you on this one. It is hard to find good unbiased information. I immunized all my kids but have since become very particular about the boosters. My kids are older youngest is 16. This year my college age daughter who is becoming a nurse had to have all the shots that she escaped as a child…..good point about how they are increasing. I was so sad….it included a flu shot which I don’t do anymore either. Sigh. I wish we had more answers….I’m right in the middle of the road with you! Thanks for the thoughtful article.
We vaccinate. I understand the concerns. I worry about possible side effects sometimes. I think we will always be confronting these issues, as people get more proactive about their health and questioning the way things are done. There is no easy answer, like most of life.
The day before my son was to receive his first round of vacs, I talked to my sister who expressed concern over vacs and told me I should be careful. This was thirty years ago and I was pretty much just going to do the standard thing but she scared me with some of her information. I raced to the library to try and find articles about this. I couldn’t find anything and went ahead with the vacs. I strongly believe that my son had a reaction to the vac. The Dr. did not believe me but we did choose to opt out of some of the shots because of this. Even 3o years ago we were unsure of what to do. I’m still not sure what I would do today if I had to do it all over again.
I believe somebody already mentioned Dr. Sears “The Vaccine Book.” Before my oldest was born I told my husband we were going to do some research and this is the resource we used. Very unbiased. We use the delayed/spread out schedule mostly and it has gone well for us. Hubby was all for ALL vaccines until he read the book :). We each made a list of what vaccines we thought were important and then sat down to discuss. He had LESS vaccine on his list than I had.
Our pediatricians are very much partners in the care of our children and will make recommendations but let us make the best choice for us. I <3 that! Thankfully they also are proponents of holistic medicine and recommend & support alternative therapies (i.e. chiropractic care for ear infections).
We have so long to show proof of vaccinations before a child is removed from school (IL). So I guess my question is, do we even have a choice in the matter?!
Yes. You absolutely have a choice. You will have to fill out paperwork to opt out, and you may want to be careful what you sign. Kelly explains her “saga” here: https://kellythekitchenkop.com/2011/02/updates-on-our-vaccination-saga.html
Excellent article. I wish I knew now what I should have known 16 years ago about this subject and I can honestly say that I would NOT have given my daughter vaccines. My best friend, has 3 children, aged 21, 18 & 15 who have never been vaccinated. They are all into healthy natural good choices in life and I can count on my one hand how many times I have seen these children sick in the past 10 years. My brother and sister-in-law have 12 year old twins who have not ever had a vaccine either, are also in healthy, all natural healthy remedies and choices in life. Again, I cannot count the number of days these kids have missed school or been sick. Hmm, makes you wonder eh! Had I done more research 16 years ago, I would have chosen the same, it has only been the last 8 years that our family has made healthy choices. We do not do antibiotics and we do not do the flu shot each year. We may catch a cold and we may get sick but we do not get sick like I have seen others sick. We are MonaVie distributors, an all-natural, healthy, 19 fruit ina bottle nutritional product that is life changing and since we have been drinking (almost 3 years now), we are pleased to say life is so much better healthy! My daughter is fine and has had no side effects of any kind from any vaccines but the more I read how they are made, what they are made of and how they are not tested….why are we putting this stuff in our children. Again, great article, enjoyed reading the comments of others as well!
https://www.amazon.com/Vaccines-They-Really-Safe-Effective/dp/1881217302
That is the book I recommend when dealing with this subject. We decided not to vaccinate our children before they were born. I, in no way, consider myself crunchy. Nor have I ever thought I was relying on others to keep my kids from getting terrible diseases. I have often been confused by some parents reactions to my children (who are only 3, 1, and 5 months old). They seem to think they shouldn’t play with their children, which, in no way, makes sense to me.
We simply believed that having no vaccine was the lesser of two evils. I didn’t choose it out of fear but because I believe the body is designed to fight of disease naturally and vaccines have the potential to not be effective. I used to work in a preschool and two children developed whooping cough one year . . . both had been vaccinated for it . . . on schedule.
I really hear where you are coming from, however. Now that my daughter is getting closer to school age, I am considering getting her vaccinated just so she’ll “fit in” at school and so we won’t have to fight the school administration on this issue.
Sigh . . . what to do?!
As far as the doctor goes, our doctor actually does not vaccinate so it is a non-issue. He is homeopathic but can and does prescribe drug IF ACTUALLY NEEDED. Which for my children (all three of them combined) has only been twice thus far.
Steiner Medial in Phoenixville is where I go. And my friend Kelly recommends Dr. Fried in Kimberton. Her kids aren’t vaxed.